Difference between revisions of "Decision panels/SOAS"

(unresolved.)
m
 
(27 intermediate revisions by 3 users not shown)
Line 1: Line 1:
 
{{TOCright2|limit=2}}
 
{{TOCright2|limit=2}}
  
==Origin==
+
==Overview==
  
 
A 12-person Sugar-on-a-Stick (SoaS) decision panel was appointed by a [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-09-25#Decision_Panel|September 25, 2009]] Oversight Board decision.
 
A 12-person Sugar-on-a-Stick (SoaS) decision panel was appointed by a [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-09-25#Decision_Panel|September 25, 2009]] Oversight Board decision.
 +
 +
The Oversight Board requested a final report, but none was received [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-11#SoaS_DP|by 2009-12-04]].  The Oversight Board then assumed responsibility for deciding the mandated questions (ibid.).  A summary [[#Conclusion|is below]].
  
 
==Mandate==
 
==Mandate==
  
{{quote|
+
{{Box|
 
:"Investigate the situation of how SoaS should be treated by Sugar Labs, and related questions, including answers to the following:
 
:"Investigate the situation of how SoaS should be treated by Sugar Labs, and related questions, including answers to the following:
:* "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
+
:* <nowiki>[Question 1]</nowiki> "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
:* "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
+
:* <nowiki>[Question 2]</nowiki> "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
:* "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
+
:* <nowiki>[Question 3]</nowiki> "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
 
:* Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question:"Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?"
 
:* Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question:"Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?"
 
}}
 
}}
Line 42: Line 44:
 
== Report ==
 
== Report ==
  
'''this is a draft'''
+
{{:Decision panels/SOAS/Report}}
  
===Introduction===
 
  
This constitutes the report of the SoaS decision panel (DP), [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/iaep/2009-September/008746.html convened by SLOB].
+
== Conclusion ==
  
The structure of this report is:
+
In the  [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-11#SoaS_DP|absence]] of a final report the Oversight board decided [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-11#SoaS_DP|Question 1,]] [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-18#Revisit_Motion_4_from_last_week|Question 2,]] and [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-18#Resolve_outstanding_Sugar_on_a_Stick_decision_.28Q3.29|Question 3]]:
  
# Introduction (this section)
+
{{Box|
# Executive Summary
+
:* <nowiki>[Question 1]</nowiki> "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
# Mandate
+
:** Answer: [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-11#SoaS_DP|No]]. SL wishes to spread the use of Sugar and consequently works with GNU/Linux distros to produce and offer downloadable versions. This work can include helping to promote distros, and hosting them.  
# Members
+
:* <nowiki>[Question 2]</nowiki> "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
# Report on Questions 1-3
+
:** Answer: [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-18#Revisit_Motion_4_from_last_week|No.]] SL may promote one distribution in its marketing campaign, but encourages all GNU/Linux distributions to package and distribute Sugar, and if possible will assist with hosting and infrastructure.
# Conclusion
+
:* <nowiki>[Question 3]</nowiki> "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
# Appendices
+
:** Answer: [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-18#Resolve_outstanding_Sugar_on_a_Stick_decision_.28Q3.29|Yes.]] "Sugar on a Stick" should be reserved by Sugar Labs for use by the SoaS-Fedora distribution so that Sugar can be marketed effectively, until such time when a trademark policy, agreement, and process is put in place: SoaS will be the first project to go through that process.
 
 
 
 
===Executive Summary===
 
 
 
The Decision Panel was [[#Mandate|mandated]] to answer three questions.  The Decision Panel's answers are below:
 
 
 
 
 
Question 1: "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
 
 
 
Answer: ''unresolved''
 
<!-- No, not now. SL is not now a full-service GNU/Linux distributor but 1) many contributors volunteer to help with individual tasks thereof; and 2) an official plan is part of a number of SugarLabs' members plans. -->
 
 
 
 
 
Question 2: "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
 
 
 
Answer: ''unresolved''
 
<!-- No. Sugar On a Stick, the Fedora-derived distribution, will be the endorsed distribution.
 
-->
 
 
 
Question 3: "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
 
 
 
Answer: ''unresolved''
 
<!-- Yes. -->
 
 
 
 
 
In addition, [[#Mandate|the mandate]] allows the Decision Panel to raise and answer any other question the DP deems required to provide an answer to the original question: "Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?" (Question 0).
 
 
 
The Decision Panel has not raised any additional questions.
 
 
 
 
 
===Mandate===
 
 
 
{{quote|
 
:"Investigate the situation of how SoaS should be treated by Sugar Labs, and related questions, including answers to the following:
 
:* "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
 
:* "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
 
:* "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
 
 
:* Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question:"Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?"
 
:* Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question:"Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?"
 +
:** Answer: [[Oversight_Board/Meeting_Minutes-2009-12-11#SoaS_DP|Sugar Labs' intent to promote Sugar as widely as possible]] means that SL will work with GNU/Linux distros to produce and offer downloadable versions. This work can include helping to promote distros, and hosting them.
 
}}
 
}}
  
===Members===
+
==Further ideas==
 
 
* Sebastian Dziallas
 
* Luke Faraone
 
* Martin Dengler
 
* Bill Bogstad
 
* Faisal Khan
 
* Benjamin M. Schwartz
 
* Samuel Klein
 
* Sean Daly
 
* Tabitha Roder
 
* Caryl Bigenho
 
* Daniel Drake
 
* Abhishek Indoria
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
===Report on Questions 1-3===
 
These questions have not been resolved yet; a minority of panel members have weighted in so far.  05:29, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
 
 
 
====Question 1====
 
 
 
 
 
Question 1: "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
 
 
 
Answer: 
 
 
 
====Question 2====
 
 
 
 
 
Question 2: "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
 
 
 
Answer: 
 
 
 
====Question 3====
 
 
 
 
 
Question 3: "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
 
 
 
Answer: 
 
 
 
 
 
===Conclusion===
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
===Appendicies===
 
 
 
 
 
====Votes / Recorded opinions====
 
 
 
 
 
=====Question 1=====
 
 
 
 
 
{| border="1"
 
|+ Question 1: "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing
 
Sugar releases?"
 
! Yes
 
! No
 
! Defer
 
! Invalid
 
! Undecided/Abstain
 
|-
 
|
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-October/000100.html Sean Daly]
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-September/000029.html Bill Bogstead]
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-October/000149.html Abhishek Indoria]
 
|
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-September/000028.html Martin Dengler]
 
# Tabitha Roder
 
# Caryl Bigenho
 
|
 
|
 
|
 
# Sebastian Dziallas
 
# Luke Faraone
 
# Faisal Khan
 
# Benjamin M. Schwartz
 
# Samuel Klein
 
# Daniel Drake
 
|}
 
 
 
 
 
=====Question 2=====
 
 
 
{| border="1"
 
|+ Question 2: "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
 
! For
 
! Against
 
! Defer
 
! Invalid
 
! Undecided/Abstain
 
|-
 
|
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-September/000028.html Martin Dengler]
 
# Tabitha Roder
 
# Caryl Bigenho
 
|
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-October/000149.html Abhishek Indoria]
 
|
 
|
 
|
 
# Sebastian Dziallas
 
# Luke Faraone
 
# Martin Dengler
 
# Bill Bogstad
 
# Faisal Khan
 
# Benjamin M. Schwartz
 
# Samuel Klein
 
# Daniel Drake
 
|}
 
 
 
 
 
=====Question 3=====
 
 
 
{| border="1"
 
|+ Question 3: "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
 
! For
 
! Against
 
! Defer
 
! Invalid
 
! Undecided/Abstain
 
|-
 
|
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-September/000045.html Sean Daly]
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-October/000149.html Abhishek Indoria]
 
# Tabitha Roder
 
|
 
# [http://lists.sugarlabs.org/archive/soas/2009-September/000028.html Martin Dengler]
 
# Caryl Bigenho
 
|
 
|
 
|
 
# Bill Bogstad
 
# Sebastian Dziallas
 
# Luke Faraone
 
# Faisal Khan
 
# Benjamin M. Schwartz
 
# Samuel Klein
 
# Daniel Drake
 
|}
 
 
 
====Further ideas====
 
 
 
=====Potential naming conventions=====
 
* Sugar4CD/PC/F11 (Sugar, version 4, made for liveCD, runs on PCs, Fedora11 based) - example from Caryl Bigenho <cbigenho@hotmail.com>
 
* There has been much talk of whether we should name with different foods and animals. Types of sugar (sucrose, glucose) has been suggested due to its link to sustainability of life.
 
There still seems to be much sense in keeping it simple with SoaS keeping one name with a version release number and corresponding release name.
 
* Perhaps including the type of media in the name could be helpful, but with "sugar" themes. For example SD versions could be "Sugar Cookies," Live CD versions could be "Sugar Pies." That would make the above example "SugarPie4/PC/F11"(also from Caryl Bigenho)
 
  
 +
* discussion of potential naming conventions.
 +
* discussion of ''how'' to support products such as SOAS, and what that means
 +
* exploration of what it means to "produce a distribution", which some active contributors felt was a huge effort and others felt was already being done, with most effort happening upstream.  Better agreement within the community about what is being done may help avoid distracting meta-debates about direction.
  
 
[[category:decision panels]]
 
[[category:decision panels]]

Latest revision as of 22:41, 5 March 2011

Overview

A 12-person Sugar-on-a-Stick (SoaS) decision panel was appointed by a September 25, 2009 Oversight Board decision.

The Oversight Board requested a final report, but none was received by 2009-12-04. The Oversight Board then assumed responsibility for deciding the mandated questions (ibid.). A summary is below.

Mandate

"Investigate the situation of how SoaS should be treated by Sugar Labs, and related questions, including answers to the following:
  • [Question 1] "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
  • [Question 2] "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
  • [Question 3] "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
  • Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question:"Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?"


Members

  • Sebastian Dziallas
  • Luke Faraone
  • Martin Dengler
  • Bill Bogstad
  • Faisal Khan
  • Benjamin M. Schwartz
  • Samuel Klein
  • Sean Daly
  • Tabitha Roder
  • Caryl Bigenho
  • Daniel Drake
  • Abhishek Indoria


Procedures

The Decision Panel procedures were adopted.

Discussion took place on the SoaS mailing list with subject lines beginning with the text "[DP]".


Report

This is a draft, and not a final report.

Introduction

This constitutes the report of the SoaS decision panel (DP), convened by SLOB.

The structure of this report is:

  1. Introduction (this section)
  2. Executive Summary
  3. Mandate
  4. Members
  5. Report on Questions 1-3
  6. Conclusion
  7. Appendices


Executive Summary

The Decision Panel was mandated to answer three questions. The Decision Panel's answers are below:

Question 1
"Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
Answer
Consensus trending towards yes. There has been some discussion about what is involved in 'being a GNU/Linux distributor' and what the risks and benefits would be; specifics have been suggested but not clearly enumerated, making consensus building harder. TBD - see below for opinions
Question 2
"Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
Answer
Consensus is yes. There are requests for clarification of how SL can promote effective ways of distributing Sugar, and endorse all good distributions. TBD - see below for opinions
Question 3
"Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
Answer
A plurality of people with definite opinions say yes, SL should ask its community to avoid using 'Sugar on a Stick' in a confusing way. There is consensus that whatever name is used for common distributions should not be used in a confusing way, but disagreement over whether SOAS should refer to a specific distribution or a broad class of them. TBD - see below for opinions


In addition, the mandate allows the Decision Panel to raise and answer any other question the DP deems required to provide an answer to the original question: "Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?" (Question 0).

The Decision Panel has not raised any additional questions, outside of requesting clarification of terms in questions 2 and 3.

Mandate

"Investigate the situation of how SoaS should be treated by Sugar Labs, and related questions, including answers to the following:
  • "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
  • "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
  • "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
  • Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question:"Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?"

Members

  • Sebastian Dziallas
  • Luke Faraone
  • Martin Dengler
  • Bill Bogstad
  • Faisal Khan
  • Benjamin M. Schwartz
  • Samuel Klein
  • Sean Daly
  • Tabitha Roder
  • Caryl Bigenho
  • Daniel Drake
  • Abhishek Indoria


Report on Questions 1-3

Q1: OS distributor v. upstream

Question 1: "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"

Proposed answers:

Yes No Invalid Undecided
  1. Yes. Without it Sugar Labs has nothing to encourage the use of or promote that is of direct use to anyone other then programmers or the people who assemble Linux distributions. (reference) counterpoint. There is real interest and are real plans to do this (reference).
  2. Yes. We greatly appreciate the work of those who have contributed to SoaS Strawberry and Blueberry. We regard these products as valuable, critical distribution mechanism for Sugar, and we will do what we can to ensure their continued development. (reference)
  1. No, not now. SL is not now a full-service GNU/Linux distributor and being one is not in SL's mission statment; "Sugar learning platform" is *not* a GNU/Linux distribution. counterpoint counter-counterpoint. However many contributors volunteer to help with individual tasks thereof; and an official plan is part of a number of SugarLabs' members published plans. Sugar Labs is better off spending its scarce resources on the Sugar learning platform. Distribution work is is really hard and labour-intensive and being done by major distro vendors already (Debian, Fedora (reference)
  1. Invalid question. An answer to this question is not needed for Sugar Labs' members to get on with their work, and the results from a decision panel will not have any effect ref.
  1. Undecided. The two sides of the argument don't seem to be speaking directly to one anothers' issue (reference) counterpoint


Q2: distro endorsement v. neutrality

Question 2: "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"

Proposed answers:


Yes No Invalid Undecided
  1. Yes.
  1. No. Sugar On a Stick, the Fedora-derived distribution, will be the endorsed distribution. SL needs to influence the distribution so drastically that it is effectively controlling it (reference) counterpoint
  1. Invalid question. An answer to this question is not needed for Sugar Labs' members to get on with their work, and the results from a decision panel will not have any effect ref.
  2. Invalid framing. Sugar Labs should be able to endorse the best methods of distributing Sugar, and not feel their hands are tied with a need to endorse all distros, regardless of their quality, or of how prominent Sugar is in the distro.
  1. Undecided: what do "neutral" and "endorse" mean? We need to be more clear about these definitions in order to answer (reference)

Q3: SoaS name

Question 3: "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"

Proposed answers:

Yes No Invalid Undecided
  1. Yes. Sugar on a Stick is the central pillar of our marketing strategy (reference). It's not trademarked, but should be (reference). SL does not want to confuse its users and a light touch like this is all that's needed (reference)
  1. No.
  1. Invalid question. An answer to this question is not needed for Sugar Labs' members to get on with their work, and the results from a decision panel will not have any effect ref.
  2. Too specific a question. Limiting SOAS to referring to a Fedora distribution is not necessary to avoid using names in a confusing way.
  1. Undecided. While it's reasonable for SL as a community to have a "don't be confusing" policy that applies equally to all of its projects, that has nothing to do with trademark per se. (reference)

DP Conclusion

to come

Appendices

Recorded opinions

Question 1

"Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"

Yes No Invalid Defer
  1. Sean Daly
  2. Bill Bogstead
  3. Abhishek Indoria
  4. Luke Faraone
  5. Sebastian Dziallas
  6. Benjamin M. Schwartz
  1. Martin Dengler
  2. Tabitha Roder
  3. Caryl Bigenho

Samuel Klein

Faisal Khan, Daniel Drake

Question 2

"Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"

Yes No Invalid Defer Undecided
  1. Martin Dengler
  2. Tabitha Roder
  3. Caryl Bigenho
  4. Luke Faraone
  5. Sebastian Dziallas
  6. Benjamin M. Schwartz - SL should make specific, not blanket endorsements
  7. Sean Daly - SL should make only context-specific endorsements
  1. Abhishek Indoria

Samuel Klein - SL should support effective distros; this can be done neutrally.

Bill Bogstad, Faisal Khan, Daniel Drake

Question 3

"Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"

Yes No Invalid Defer Undecided
  1. Sean Daly SL should reserve the right to determine which distro to associate with SOAS, today Fedora, but possibly another later.
  2. Abhishek Indoria
  3. Tabitha Roder
  4. Luke Faraone
  5. Sebastian Dziallas
  1. Martin Dengler
  2. Caryl Bigenho
  3. Benjamin M. Schwartz - use a more specific name

Samuel Klein - The question is too specific. I agree with both Ben and Sean, who feel they fall on 'Yes' and 'No' sides of the fence.

Bill Bogstad, Faisal Khan, Daniel Drake


Conclusion

In the absence of a final report the Oversight board decided Question 1, Question 2, and Question 3:

  • [Question 1] "Should Sugar Labs be a GNU/Linux distributor, rather than just an upstream producing Sugar releases?"
    • Answer: No. SL wishes to spread the use of Sugar and consequently works with GNU/Linux distros to produce and offer downloadable versions. This work can include helping to promote distros, and hosting them.
  • [Question 2] "Should SL be neutral about distributions containing Sugar, and refuse to endorse one over another?"
    • Answer: No. SL may promote one distribution in its marketing campaign, but encourages all GNU/Linux distributions to package and distribute Sugar, and if possible will assist with hosting and infrastructure.
  • [Question 3] "Should 'Sugar on a Stick' be a phrase that SL asks its community to avoid using unless they refer to the SoaS-Fedora distribution?"
    • Answer: Yes. "Sugar on a Stick" should be reserved by Sugar Labs for use by the SoaS-Fedora distribution so that Sugar can be marketed effectively, until such time when a trademark policy, agreement, and process is put in place: SoaS will be the first project to go through that process.
  • Any other question the Decision Panel deems required to provide an answer to the original question:"Is the current SoaS going to be the primary way Sugar Labs distributes a Sugar-centric GNU/Linux distribution?"

Further ideas

  • discussion of potential naming conventions.
  • discussion of how to support products such as SOAS, and what that means
  • exploration of what it means to "produce a distribution", which some active contributors felt was a huge effort and others felt was already being done, with most effort happening upstream. Better agreement within the community about what is being done may help avoid distracting meta-debates about direction.