Talk:Requesting a SLOBs decision: Difference between revisions

Line 1:

<noinclude>{{TOCright}}</noinclude>

This is currently an options-brainstorming page for several things:

Line 134:

Line 133:

15:17:10 * sdziallas looks around, wonders what kind of meeting is going on here.

15:18:17< mchua> tomeu: http://fpaste.org/qzZU/

15:18:56< mchua> sdziallas: we're coming up with a few draft sets of governance procedures for SLOBs, to be (hopefully) ratified at the next meeting so we have a clear notion of what the decision making process is for various things

15:18:56< mchua> sdziallas: we're coming up with a few draft sets of governance procedures for SLOBs,

to be (hopefully) ratified at the next meeting so we have a clear notion of what the

decision making process is for various things

15:18:58< tomeu> sdziallas: it's a surprise meeting ;)

15:19:10< sdziallas> mchua, tomeu: hiya :)

Line 146:

Line 147:

15:21:27< tomeu> mchua: I have 40 minutes before a conf call

15:21:29 * mtd shuts up now.

15:22:01< mchua> tomeu: Okay. We can't get through that entire list in that time, so I'd propose we start with "What are the things requiring a SLOBs decision?"

15:22:01< mchua> tomeu: Okay. We can't get through that entire list in that time, so I'd propose we start

with "What are the things requiring a SLOBs decision?"

15:22:10< mchua> brainstorm a list for that

15:22:17< tomeu> hmm

Line 157:

Line 159:

15:23:15< mchua> and then have SLOBs's first set of decisions be to go down that list and say yes/no.

15:23:17< mchua> to each.

15:23:43< mchua> 10m at most to brainstorm that list, and then the remainder of the time coming up with several variants of "What is the process by which a SLOBs decision is..."

15:23:43< mchua> 10m at most to brainstorm that list, and then the remainder of the time coming up with several

variants of "What is the process by which a SLOBs decision is..."

15:23:54< mchua> {requested, made, announced, amended, etc}

15:24:00< tomeu> hmm

Line 168:

Line 171:

15:25:29< mchua> and leaving it to SLOBs discretion is starting to not work as well as we scale up

15:25:42-!- walterbender [n=chatzill@18.85.49.106] has quit [Remote closed the connection]

15:26:02< mchua> what do we need to ask SLOBs about? what don't we? Most of it is "no, you don't have to ask," but this isn't very clear yet.

15:26:02< mchua> what do we need to ask SLOBs about? what don't we? Most of it is "no, you don't have to ask,"

but this isn't very clear yet.

15:26:07< tomeu> mchua: ok, but are we going to find a concrete set of subjects that people will accept?

15:26:25< tomeu> ok, if we are brainstorming:

Line 177:

Line 181:

15:27:50< mchua> - disbursement of funds that come from the SL treasury

15:27:58-!- FranXOphonie [n=FranXOph@208.111.82.68] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)]

15:28:38< mchua> - granting a project Official SL Project Status (which allows it to use the trademark, gives it a mailing list, other benefits we need to outline at some point)

15:28:38< mchua> - granting a project Official SL Project Status (which allows it to use the trademark, gives it a

mailing list, other benefits we need to outline at some point)

15:28:56 * mchua will also start listing things that should NOT come through slobs (still in brainstorm mode)

15:29:05< mchua> NOT: sending out press releases (Marketing team)

15:29:13< mchua> NOT: can I start this project (just do it)

15:29:17< mchua> NOT: can I join the project (just do it)

15:29:48< mchua> NOT: can I give a talk/presentation about Sugar Labs at $occasion (just do it, but please share your stuff so others can remix it)

15:29:48< mchua> NOT: can I give a talk/presentation about Sugar Labs at $occasion (just do it, but please share

your stuff so others can remix it)

15:30:18< mchua> NOT: can I add this feature to the code / what's going to be in the next release (Development team)

15:30:27< mchua> NOT: design issues (Design team)

15:31:05< mchua> NOT: can we install $foobar for our ticket tracker / wiki / etc? (Infrastructure team)

15:31:08< tomeu> remove someone from a position such as maintainer, sysadmin, ml moderator, etc because of behavior against SLs mission

15:31:08< tomeu> remove someone from a position such as maintainer, sysadmin, ml moderator, etc because of behavior

against SLs mission

15:31:46-!- CanoeBerry__ is now known as CanoeBerry

15:32:02< tomeu> whenever you have a platform, you are going to be bugged about this things

15:32:09< tomeu> oops

15:32:20< tomeu> (that was for #sugar)

15:32:40< mchua> NOT: first-level conflict resolution (only when public dialogue on mailing lists has failed should there be an appeal for ombudsperson/SLOBs to step in for a specific decision related to one of the decision-types we /can/ make)

15:32:40< mchua> NOT: first-level conflict resolution (only when public dialogue on mailing lists has failed should

there be an appeal for ombudsperson/SLOBs to step in for a specific decision related to one of

the decision-types we /can/ make)

15:33:18< mchua> NOT: can I start this deployment (just do it)

15:33:49< tomeu> changes in the governance rules?

15:34:03< mchua> and amendments to the mission/vision statements

15:34:48< mchua> examples of official statements (from the first brainstorm on this list) would be "$FOO announces $BAR in partnership with Sugar Labs"

15:34:48< mchua> examples of official statements (from the first brainstorm on this list) would be "$FOO announces

$BAR in partnership with Sugar Labs"

15:34:54< tomeu> mchua: btw, will you have time later today? I will be free from 16 UTC

15:35:13< mchua> anything that says something like "a Sugar Labs project" or "in partnership with Sugar Labs"

Line 247:

Line 257:

15:45:02< tomeu> ok

15:45:22< mchua> for that initial triage, we have a couple options

15:45:59< mchua> * that week's meeting chair triages (since they're preparing the agenda) BUT a majority (4) of other SLOBs can override that triage and bring the topic up for discussion on the meeting anyway

15:45:59< mchua> * that week's meeting chair triages (since they're preparing the agenda) BUT a majority (4) of

other SLOBs can override that triage and bring the topic up for discussion on the meeting anyway

15:46:48< mchua> * robert's rules: a motion has to be made and then seconded for a vote

15:47:04< mchua> (with the implication that everything that isn't made into a motion is dropped from the agenda)

15:47:09< mchua> (and the agenda purged each week)

15:47:17< mchua> * others?

15:47:30 * mchua wants to do some sort of regular purge to make sure only active issues come up, and that the list stays trimmed and very very small

15:47:30 * mchua wants to do some sort of regular purge to make sure only active issues come up, and that the list

stays trimmed and very very small

15:47:42< mchua> (but that's my personal preference for extremely minimal governance)

15:48:18< tomeu> as can bee seen here, action items can accumulate as well: http://live.gnome.org/FoundationBoardPublic/Minutes/20090917

15:48:23 * mchua nods, grins

15:48:47-!- edmcnierney_away is now known as edmcnierney

15:49:28< mchua> another option: 4 SLOBs (a majority) have to +1 an item for a SLOBs decision (either at the meeting or on the agenda page beforehand), or it goes into wontfix

15:49:28< mchua> another option: 4 SLOBs (a majority) have to +1 an item for a SLOBs decision (either at the meeting or

on the agenda page beforehand), or it goes into wontfix

15:49:31< mchua> (but can be brought up again later)

15:49:46< mchua> aaanyway, once something is in "yes, this is a SLOBs decision" state, what do we do?

Line 264:

Line 277:

15:50:23< mchua> option 3: majority needed, no dissent (at least 4 yea, no nay)

15:50:42< mchua> option 4: simple voting (more yeas than nays)

15:51:32< mchua> (I'm assuming that all issues being Decided have already had extended mailing list discussions, so it's really the decision and not the discussion that needs to happen at these meetings.)

15:51:32< mchua> (I'm assuming that all issues being Decided have already had extended mailing list discussions,

so it's really the decision and not the discussion that needs to happen at these meetings.)

15:51:52< tomeu> option 4 could have a quorum

15:52:17-!- walterbender [n=chatzill@18.85.49.106] has joined #sugar-meeting

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
+<noinclude>{{TOCright}}</noinclude>
 This is currently an options-brainstorming page for several things:
@@ Line 134: / Line 133: @@
 :17:10 * sdziallas looks around, wonders what kind of meeting is going on here.
 :18:17< mchua> tomeu: http://fpaste.org/qzZU/
-:18:56< mchua> sdziallas: we're coming up with a few draft sets of governance procedures for SLOBs, to be (hopefully) ratified at the next meeting so we have a clear notion of what the decision making process is for various things
+:18:56< mchua> sdziallas: we're coming up with a few draft sets of governance procedures for SLOBs,
+                 to be (hopefully) ratified at the next meeting so we have a clear notion of what the
+                 decision making process is for various things
 :18:58< tomeu> sdziallas: it's a surprise meeting ;)
 :19:10< sdziallas> mchua, tomeu: hiya :)
@@ Line 146: / Line 147: @@
 :21:27< tomeu> mchua: I have 40 minutes before a conf call
 :21:29 * mtd shuts up now.
-:22:01< mchua> tomeu: Okay. We can't get through that entire list in that time, so I'd propose we start with "What are the things requiring a SLOBs decision?"
+:22:01< mchua> tomeu: Okay. We can't get through that entire list in that time, so I'd propose we start
+                 with "What are the things requiring a SLOBs decision?"
 :22:10< mchua> brainstorm a list for that
 :22:17< tomeu> hmm
@@ Line 157: / Line 159: @@
 :23:15< mchua> and then have SLOBs's first set of decisions be to go down that list and say yes/no.
 :23:17< mchua> to each.
-:23:43< mchua> 10m at most to brainstorm that list, and then the remainder of the time coming up with several variants of "What is the process by which a SLOBs decision is..."
+:23:43< mchua> 10m at most to brainstorm that list, and then the remainder of the time coming up with several
+                 variants of "What is the process by which a SLOBs decision is..."
 :23:54< mchua> {requested, made, announced, amended, etc}
 :24:00< tomeu> hmm
@@ Line 168: / Line 171: @@
 :25:29< mchua> and leaving it to SLOBs discretion is starting to not work as well as we scale up
 :25:42-!- walterbender [n=chatzill@18.85.49.106] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
-:26:02< mchua> what do we need to ask SLOBs about? what don't we? Most of it is "no, you don't have to ask," but this isn't very clear yet.
+:26:02< mchua> what do we need to ask SLOBs about? what don't we? Most of it is "no, you don't have to ask,"
+                 but this isn't very clear yet.
 :26:07< tomeu> mchua: ok, but are we going to find a concrete set of subjects that people will accept?
 :26:25< tomeu> ok, if we are brainstorming:
@@ Line 177: / Line 181: @@
 :27:50< mchua> - disbursement of funds that come from the SL treasury
 :27:58-!- FranXOphonie [n=FranXOph@208.111.82.68] has quit [Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)]
-:28:38< mchua> - granting a project Official SL Project Status (which allows it to use the trademark, gives it a mailing list, other benefits we need to outline at some point)
+:28:38< mchua> - granting a project Official SL Project Status (which allows it to use the trademark, gives it a
+                 mailing list, other benefits we need to outline at some point)
 :28:56 * mchua will also start listing things that should NOT come through slobs (still in brainstorm mode)
 :29:05< mchua> NOT: sending out press releases (Marketing team)
 :29:13< mchua> NOT: can I start this project (just do it)
 :29:17< mchua> NOT: can I join the project (just do it)
-:29:48< mchua> NOT: can I give a talk/presentation about Sugar Labs at $occasion (just do it, but please share your stuff so others can remix it)
+:29:48< mchua> NOT: can I give a talk/presentation about Sugar Labs at $occasion (just do it, but please share
+                      your stuff so others can remix it)
 :30:18< mchua> NOT: can I add this feature to the code / what's going to be in the next release (Development team)
 :30:27< mchua> NOT: design issues (Design team)
 :31:05< mchua> NOT: can we install $foobar for our ticket tracker / wiki / etc? (Infrastructure team)
-:31:08< tomeu> remove someone from a position such as maintainer, sysadmin, ml moderator, etc because of behavior against SLs mission
+:31:08< tomeu> remove someone from a position such as maintainer, sysadmin, ml moderator, etc because of behavior
+                 against SLs mission
 :31:46-!- CanoeBerry__ is now known as CanoeBerry
 :32:02< tomeu> whenever you have a platform, you are going to be bugged about this things
 :32:09< tomeu> oops
 :32:20< tomeu> (that was for #sugar)
-:32:40< mchua> NOT: first-level conflict resolution (only when public dialogue on mailing lists has failed should there be an appeal for ombudsperson/SLOBs to step in for a specific decision related to one of the decision-types we /can/ make)
+:32:40< mchua> NOT: first-level conflict resolution (only when public dialogue on mailing lists has failed should
+                      there be an appeal for ombudsperson/SLOBs to step in for a specific decision related to one of
+                      the decision-types we /can/ make)
 :33:18< mchua> NOT: can I start this deployment (just do it)
 :33:49< tomeu> changes in the governance rules?
 :34:03< mchua> and amendments to the mission/vision statements
-:34:48< mchua> examples of official statements (from the first brainstorm on this list) would be "$FOO announces $BAR in partnership with Sugar Labs"
+:34:48< mchua> examples of official statements (from the first brainstorm on this list) would be "$FOO announces
+                 $BAR in partnership with Sugar Labs"
 :34:54< tomeu> mchua: btw, will you have time later today? I will be free from 16 UTC
 :35:13< mchua> anything that says something like "a Sugar Labs project" or "in partnership with Sugar Labs"
@@ Line 247: / Line 257: @@
 :45:02< tomeu> ok
 :45:22< mchua> for that initial triage, we have a couple options
-:45:59< mchua> * that week's meeting chair triages (since they're preparing the agenda) BUT a majority (4) of other SLOBs can override that triage and bring the topic up for discussion on the meeting anyway
+:45:59< mchua> * that week's meeting chair triages (since they're preparing the agenda) BUT a majority (4) of
+                 other SLOBs can override that triage and bring the topic up for discussion on the meeting anyway
 :46:48< mchua> * robert's rules: a motion has to be made and then seconded for a vote
 :47:04< mchua> (with the implication that everything that isn't made into a motion is dropped from the agenda)
 :47:09< mchua> (and the agenda purged each week)
 :47:17< mchua> * others?
-:47:30 * mchua wants to do some sort of regular purge to make sure only active issues come up, and that the list stays trimmed and very very small
+:47:30 * mchua wants to do some sort of regular purge to make sure only active issues come up, and that the list
+         stays trimmed and very very small
 :47:42< mchua> (but that's my personal preference for extremely minimal governance)
 :48:18< tomeu> as can bee seen here, action items can accumulate as well: http://live.gnome.org/FoundationBoardPublic/Minutes/20090917
 :48:23 * mchua nods, grins
 :48:47-!- edmcnierney_away is now known as edmcnierney
-:49:28< mchua> another option: 4 SLOBs (a majority) have to +1 an item for a SLOBs decision (either at the meeting or on the agenda page beforehand), or it goes into wontfix
+:49:28< mchua> another option: 4 SLOBs (a majority) have to +1 an item for a SLOBs decision (either at the meeting or
+                 on the agenda page beforehand), or it goes into wontfix
 :49:31< mchua> (but can be brought up again later)
 :49:46< mchua> aaanyway, once something is in "yes, this is a SLOBs decision" state, what do we do?
@@ Line 264: / Line 277: @@
 :50:23< mchua> option 3: majority needed, no dissent (at least 4 yea, no nay)
 :50:42< mchua> option 4: simple voting (more yeas than nays)
-:51:32< mchua> (I'm assuming that all issues being Decided have already had extended mailing list discussions, so it's really the decision and not the discussion that needs to happen at these meetings.)
+:51:32< mchua> (I'm assuming that all issues being Decided have already had extended mailing list discussions,
+                 so it's really the decision and not the discussion that needs to happen at these meetings.)
 :51:52< tomeu> option 4 could have a quorum
 :52:17-!- walterbender [n=chatzill@18.85.49.106] has joined #sugar-meeting